Lawson v10 Questions

We're in the same boat, in the midst of testing v10, and we've no use for Ming Lee. We're hosted by AMS, if you're not, it may be different for you. AMS says that while it may work, llinking directly to the portal URL is not supported. We've had some success with it before we got ADFS authentication in place. Now, when we try that, we get past ADFS authentication, but portal never comes up.

If you're ONLY using Smart Office -- for everything -- then you don't need Mingle.

John, if you are a LID shop moving to V10 and plan on using the free LID replacement which I believe is Workspace, then you are forced to install SharePoint and the basic Mingle engine? I'm sure I'm not alone in being less than thrilled with having to add additional servers every time a new technology is adopted to service some component of S3. We ran Lawson on one box up until V9 and as it stands now I think we are looking at needing 6 (Web server, Application server, Sql server, Federation server, LBI server and SharePoint server) or 7 if you want Websphere on it's own. The mainframe is starting to look appealing again!

Workspace == Mingle, so yes you need SharePoint for it.
You don't have to put EVERYTHING on a separate box.

Ok, we presently have Apps, SQL and WAS all on same machine. Web server and LBI are separate and will probably need to remain that way.
Based on the V10 instances you have seen thus far, what are the candidates for residing on the same server? Thanks.

Technically you can still have everything on one server, just don't expect it to run very well

It's all preference on desired performance, but a typical Infor 10 roll out would include LSF (WebSphere, Web Server, ISS), SQL Server, LBI, and Ming.le (SharePoint). Some prefer a separate Web Server.

We ended up with 4 servers. But I'd add that we don't have a massive number of users. And I agree, using Ming.le seems like a complete waste of resources. My 2 pennys
LSF and Web on one
Ming.le and SharePoint together
Landmark
SQL

Thanks for the suggestions. We currently have an additional IIS and Endpoint deployed on a DMZ server to provide for external EMSS availability. I don't see any way around that moving ahead and we probably wouldn't want to put anything else on it that since it has a higher risk of exposure to the outside world. Once we go through our V10 sizing exercises we'll have a better idea if WAS and SQL can continue to reside on our App server or get split out and if anything can be combined onto the SharePoint and Landmark servers. We have an existing SharePoint server for another application, has anyone leveraged that type of setup or is a new SharePoint instance dedicated to Mingle the only way to go?

Joe,
An easy move is to move the database off of the app server. I don't think you can move all of WAS off of the app server. I know you can setup the management server (old dmgr) onto a different box, but I'm almost certain you have to continue to have a node (and resultant WAS app servers) on the Infor App Tier.

As for the DMZ and EMSC access, definitely keep it that way.

As for existing SharePoint, Infor has stated that you should NOT use it for the Infor stack. I don't believe this position has changed.

We went to v10 in 2014...and we have 5 servers per environment. This is our configuration (we're a Windows OS with SQL Database):

Server 1 - Lawson App & WebSphere
Server 2 - Database
Server 3 - LBI
Server 4 - Sharepoint
(Unfortunately, there was a lot of confusion and what now appears to have been misdirection at the time we were doing our upgrade and we were informed (?mis-informed) that Mingle was required in lieu of the Portal on v10. As a result, since Sharepoint is required for Mingle usage, we now had to add what, in our opinion are, two useless additional layers of administration. Our users found no benefit from Mingle, over what they were used to in the old 9.0.1 Portal. Therefore, we find the need to install and maintain both a waste of time. Thankfully, we are hearing that in v11, Mingle/Sharepoint are no longer required and you can once again use the portal directly without the additional presentation layer.)
Server 5 - Landmark
(Since we replaced Process Flow with IPA, we were required to add Landmark, which we did not have before. Presently, IPA is all we use Landmark for. However, we it sounds like security will be moving from LSF to Landmark/Rich Client, so this will be another reason to support Landmark.)

Additionally, we use MHC, so we also need to add to that another 3 additional MHC servers, which we consider part of our Lawson cluster since that is all they support and the need to support it is a direct result of Lawson.

All that being said, aside from not particularly caring for the need to use Mingle (and thus a new Sharepoint instance) instead of directly using the portal, we have been pleased with the performance. We have found much greater stability since upgrading to v10 with this configuration.

Thanks for the info, are you saying you could have used Portal V10 without Mingle/Sharepoint?
As for SQL, did your team find there was a tangible benefit to have it on it's own machine or was this just done as protocol for separation of function?
Just out of curiosity, what are the purposes of your 3 MHC servers? It sounds like it may be similar to what we have (DE, DSS, etc.)
Lastly, are any of your boxes VM?

Joe, please see my responses below...

Mingle/Sharepoint:
I can't really answer your first question. We were initially told that we could not use portal directly. During testing, we did see some issues when trying to do so (mainly compatibility-type problems when moving between portal, LBI, MSCM, etc., as well as problems seeing all content when multiple sessions are launched). Throughout testing and even since going live, we had continued to hear differing opinions as to whether or not Sharepoint//Mingle were required or just recommended. Therefore, the decision was made to stick to Mingle/Sharepoint and we've been using it (somewhat begrudgingly) ever since.

SQL:
I don't know if this is/was a "Lawson recommendation" or not. This is just how we've always been set up, using a separate, dedicated server for the Lawson database due to it's size.

MHC Config:
For us, we have one MHCAPP server. Then we also have one that houses the MHC databases: Image Express, Document Express & Doc Self Service. (This one also has client installs of both Doc Express & Image Express.) There is a third server that is dedicated to Image Express, where the processing, printing and workflows are all done form. (Additionally, we have a 4th server in the DMZ outside our firewall, that I did not mention above, which provides the IIS for access to Document Self Service.)

VM:
Yes, all of our servers are virtual.

In my preliminary discussions with Infor upgrade partners I was told that Mingle was a must in V10 with Workspace and Portal delivered inside. Not having used Workspace, I'm eager for clarification on what our users will be working with. Are Workspace and Portal both available for S3 apps or is Portal only there for Web apps such as EMSS?
A learning curve will be necessary to move our users from LID to Portal prior to our upgrade since we want to implement LS security and if they need to learn yet another interface after the upgrade it will not be pretty.
We also have a number of scripts that our end users run from the gray LID screen which invoke a combination of non Lawson and Lawson delivered interface programs such as ImportDB.
Is my understanding correct that scripts and S3 system commands will still function in V10 LID although it can no longer be used for S3 Forms?

Joe,
i have a number of clients that only have portal and/or self service modules (such as EMSC), and they only use the traditional portal interface. I believe you can still use portal as you did in v9.0.1, as it is AVAILABLE.

Now, with that said, you absolutely need Ming.le Foundation installed somewhere connected to the environment in question, as that is required to be SUPPORTED.

Will portal go away, it's definitely possible, as is the possibility of SharePoint becoming optional. But SharePoint is here to stay, as they have too much investment in the concept of using an ECM as a front end. (Ignore the fact that SharePoint isn't really a true ECM).

I think the key here is Infor as a company made a declaration toward an Microsoft-centric stack, PRIOR to buying Lawson Software. After the purchase and related debt swaps created the unified Infor of today, the goal of realizing a Microsoft-centric platform isn't realistic, able to be realized, and/or impractical, without destroying the very reason the deal happened in the first place.

Recall the command that SharePoint be used was based on the work being done at the time, prior to the companies being unified, but after a controlling interest had been made.

Basically, it was good PR for the executive team, at that time. Now they can realistically state that it's not needed, and not have to save face.

But as yet, they haven't actually committed to a direction on either side, being to make Sharepoint optional, to eliminate portal, or even to use another ECM system.

But for now, Portal still works, and the clients I have advised are using that fact to extend their transition periods onto Ming.le

Thanks for your commentary Kwane, with all this said...
1) You say as it is available, so in general we should still be able to use Portal for S3 apps (AP92, HR11, PR140, etc.) in V10?
2) Are there big differences or significant improvements using Workspace vs. Portal in V10? (Our users state that print manager, job scheduler and drilling are presently more cumbersome in Portal compared to LID)
3) Will CMD scripts and Lawson supplied commands (ImportDB, etc) still work in gray LID screen for application (non admin) users in V10?